Harry Weidner: 0:01

Take a look. All right. Welcome back to our tangled minds. Welcome to our tangled mind. I'm Harry Weidner.

Jack Weidner: 0:11

I'm Jack Bagnato.

Harry Weidner: 0:12

Episode 26, we're back. We took a week off because I was stressed. I had too much going on and I couldn't squeeze out some time to do this. And I'm sorry, I do apologize, but that's what happens. I'm sure they'll be okay. Everyone's okay. But we're back. What's the ratio? Now from? Something? I haven't told a lot of people yet. So I'm not going to guess that. I need to tell more people look at nothing's new with anyone here. No. I didn't tell people. Okay, well, I'm gonna keep this. I'll keep this in. I'll keep this in and keep everyone guessing. Nothing's new. In case you were wondering, probably good. And it's nice to see you. Nice to talk to you. Yeah. we've chatted a little bit. we've chatted here and there briefly, but not much, not too much. What's new with you, now that I'm getting increasingly worried that I'm not going to get into medical school? So goes the reality of medical applying to medical school. And so I'm just looking into internships or jobs. I, I reckon my logical move is move out to Colorado. regard. I don't understand. See, that's the one thing I don't understand. Like, I'm totally in support if you're going to Colorado, but you saying the logical move is for me to move to the middle of the country doesn't make sense? Well, let's talk about my head. And this is your house. And as you are retired, this is a new. This is an issue that stems from the microcosm of my neuroticism. Okay, I need a plan. Now I need to sit around with a plan A and I need to not be floating in limbo, waiting for medical school. And so if I can get ahead of the curve, by planning to move to Colorado, and having a job or an internship, then if Colorado were to say, Congratulations, you have a spot in our class, then I'm already there. And I need that plan in my head. Because waiting until my lease ends in Boston, having to move back home or possibly having to move back home is fine. But I would rather just go here to there. And avoid like this weird space where I'm not quite sure what's going on. So then if you apply to med school again with that, would Colorado be your first choice? Yeah, probably because you'd be there. I mean, who knows? Who knows what could happen? There's,

Jack Weidner: 2:54

there's a lot up in the air. You can't say I'm going to move to Colorado, in case. And then when asked the question, what if in a year, you reapply to med school is Colorado all like art? Are your eggs in the Colorado basket? And then say let's play by here? Yes, I

Harry Weidner: 3:13

can that yes, I bet. Yes, I

Jack Weidner: 3:15

will music to jazz. You're not George Gershwin. No, I

Harry Weidner: 3:19

can do whatever I want there. And I'll tell you what, because because I want to ask you to write one. Fucking why. And no, it's one. It's my life. And I can do whatever I want to. I would much rather make actions based on what I currently think then what I thought. And so and I yeah, I want you to do that. I don't want you to say it's the logical thing. It is. I'm totally cool with you being like, I want to move to Colorado. I don't know why that's the choice. The choice then becomes logical because you made it not because it is inherently logical for you to be like, I'm gonna move to Colorado. Did you die? No, but okay, it may be for you. But for me, it's that, okay, that's where we've landed here. That's fine, too. Yeah, it makes sense in my head. And so I'm gonna say it makes sense. Okay, sorry. Hey, yeah, I'm just curious, because I'm one sad that you are moving to Colorado. No, it's gonna be here that this is this is the car. Well, hang on. Give me Give me two seconds. Take your time. I said, I'm bummed. I told Haley this while I was making dinner I said Harry just told me Colorado like I'm excited for him. I'm a little bit bummed that you know, like I was holding out a little bit of hope that you and I would end up at the same place just so we'd be a little bit closer so we could like, maybe do this in person. I don't know. Maybe get coffee like once a month. That would be fun. Well, hey, got coffee. I'm fine. She looked at me and said, he's in Boston right now, what's the difference? And I said, I'd like drew a map of the globe because I'm an asshole. And I was like, Okay, we're here. Boston's here, Colorado's over in the other fucking apartment. Yes, far. But her point being we don't see each other now. But it was a dash of hope, because there's no way in hell. But I think it would be fun if you came out to visit. Oh, I'd come visit. Yeah, yeah, it visits the heck out of here. We'd be sweet. It's a it's a cool place. So it's I'm excited. I'm excited. And so yeah, I've rationalized it in my head. And it makes sense a lot. It's exactly yeah, so you and I were pretty similar. So that's what's new with me. Oh, I'm applying to an internship at Pfizer have really cool internship at Pfizer. So if anyone knows any contacts at Pfizer, let me know. Because I would really appreciate that connection. Ours. Internship would be one of the coolest experiences that I could have. It's sort of Jack thankfully helped edit my cover letter. And it would be a really great experience that operates at the crossroads of clinical health, public health, and data analytics. And it's I love that space. So if you know anything, let me know. Yeah, that was super fun helping you with your thing. I texted you that but I had a really it was actually like, you reminded me that I like editing, and helping people use words to communicate their ideas. I appreciated your home. You've done my job now that you've edited boring documents, and I format them and like, it's horrible life stalking. Terrible. That reminded me why I got into this in the person. Well, I appreciate your help. I really needed that. That's exciting that Pfizer though that's, I mean, dude, I want this internship so badly. I know a lot of middle aged white men that have a lot of thoughts on Pfizer, but none of them know anyone who worked there, except for Anthony Fauci. It's a, it's an interesting place to work. It I think that if I were to get this internship, I would learn a lot about I that I'm curious about this, because increasingly, I think, in my head, because of COVID, I have looked at Pfizer as a wing, or at least an extension of the CDC, or the government as a whole, the Department of Health, which it is not, it's not a part of this chronic problem where America privatizes. So I would be curious, for two to learn kind of like how they approach being a privatized entity that works for the betterment of society, that is also a for profit company that is paid by the government to do the work that they don't have the capability to do because they privatized this section of an industry, right. It's an interesting space to operate in. And I've been thinking a lot about that. The more because they're hiring people in public health. Yep. So how can we bleed public health into these privatized sectors to make them more public healthy? Right. No, I mean, that makes sense. Someone like me could argue that maybe all of that could be done not in a capitalistic way. Yeah. And maybe you could get those people into a an aid maybe not even a government agency, maybe a charity or something. I don't know. There's I think there's other ways to do it. Yeah. You just have to throw money at things. Yeah. I have a lot of thoughts on private well, I have worked thoughts that I can't share it but like it even like education like this idea of like privatizing government things I would be excited from a selfish reason if you got this job at Pfizer because I do love to hear what the mindset there is and how you as someone who cares very much about public health kind of occupy that liminal space but you know, it's a gray area. That's interesting. Yeah, it's it's a big gray area. It's an interesting gray area. I really want this internship Yeah, I Yeah. So I think I would just learn so much and love it. Anyway, it is cool. Anyway, all right. Let's do this is good boss coming out in session, a same topic, different ways because I think we both did that for this assignment. Would you like to you you for this episode, you gave an assignment. Yeah. I thought it would be interesting. I thought it would be interesting if Jack and I both found a piece of news that we've read in the past. I don't know, month or so, however long. And but in positive news, because I'm sick of negative news, negative news is not fun. And I wanted to see what you would bring me. And I brought you something, I brought you something in public health, just because that's where I spend most of my days. I haven't read what Jack Jack found, and I haven't read wheat. None of us know what we're so we're gonna do the exchange now. Georgia go first. Yeah, sure, I'll go first, I got you an article about a CDC initiative to increase HIV at home testing. Okay, I think HIV is a fascinating disease, both biochemically and from a public health perspective, because of the stigma around it. And there are all these lofty goals to end HIV transmission. But those need to start with people getting tested. And so this initiative, it's called together take me home, the TT MH initiative. And it, it significantly impacted the distribution of HIV self test kits. And what they did was they used online platforms like online dating platforms, a lot of Grindr testing, to distribute accessible HIV testing. So they ended up shipping from March to December 2023 337,812. Tests, why and that was over 181,558 orders placed. So a majority of the tests were to test orders, which is awesome, so that people can test repeatedly. And it's important to say that these tests are highly sensitive and specific. So they're not 100% accurate, but they're pretty damn good. They're better than not getting tested at all. 62% of the orders were placed through grinder 25% over 25% were first time testers which is huge, because the more people you test, the more idea you have of how many people are HIV positive. And the positive cess self test result rate was around 2.1%. So a caught a good bit of HIV. And hopefully, the linkage to care was great after that. I know they talked about it in the article. And I said, and I think they said that the linkage to care after testing positive was pretty good. A 61% went to two men with male partners with 18%, identifying as black and 33% as Hispanic, even even having a higher percentage of black women ordering tests is a good step forward. I think this test, or this, this, this initiative through social media and increasing people's access to testing is huge, because it reduces the stigma associated with going to a clinic and getting a test. Cool. And so it was a huge success. I was happy to see that this was done. I was surprised that it wasn't done earlier. How? How does an article like this make you hopeful for the future? Yeah, so now we know that it works. And people are using these social media platforms to as a way that they can access testing. So given its success, I would say the program could scale up for HIV testing, more widespread, and also other self testable, communicable diseases. So who knows how technology could implement these things? If it works on Grindr? Why not make it a more permanent thing on Grindr? You know, maybe partner with Grindr to have this as a permanent link that people can access to order HIV testing at little to no cost. I think it makes me hopeful for the future of self testing. A lot of people are familiar with self tests from COVID. But if we can self test and increase the number of people who are testing for HIV, that could significantly reduce the burden of HIV across the US and beyond. How can we use this in other countries, like maybe a Sub Saharan Africa where there's a lot of stigma associated with going to an HIV clinic? This really reduces the burden of people to have to go to the clinic. Because, you know, if you ask someone with HIV, do you want to go to a clinic? A lot of the time the answer is going to be no. So I was going to ask if you think like this is this makes you hopeful for kind of, not really Moving but significantly make the stigma reducing the stigma. Yeah, reducing stigma and sort of logistical challenges of accessing care is huge, especially for these stigmatized illnesses, like HIV or other STIs. Even. So if you can reduce the stigma, and it's important that you give them an avenue to link to care afterward. So if you get a positive test, that's not very helpful, unless you're linked to care. And I don't recall how this initiative, specifically linked people to care, after testing, but they had something implemented that, that they were able to get care. And I they said 6.5% sought further STI testing. So pretty good numbers. But pilot study. So. Yeah, so great results, hopeful for the future and great results, hopefully, for the future and who, and I think this will unlock the door to more any sort of flexible healthcare delivery model that meets patients where they are, is productive. And so the fact that this was rolled out and had such great success and high enrollment is huge. I think as we sort of accept telehealth as a better mode of delivering health care, we will see an increase in equitable access to health care across the United States. Do you think a lot of this isn't in the article? Do you think a lot of this was inspired by the success of the at home COVID tests? It might have been you know, so this this ran from March to December 2023. I don't know the motivations behind it specifically, but it could very well have been, you know, an initiative that stemmed from that. Sure. That's what I had. I thought that was great news. No, that is that's really cool. We're this gonna be a quick one. I will share mine with you might be a little different. I figured it would be um, I'd say we'd put these in the in the description book minds behind a paywall, because I didn't think wow. Yeah, cuz it's the times I chose a modern love short story. That makes me cry every time I read it. Apply this. Okay. That's the first one. I asked Jack to find some new news. And he sent me a story you didn't say new news. You say I was published in 2019 It set news that gives me hope. And I coming back to this one. Okay. This is news that gives me out. I can actually just read it. Because it's so short. So tiny love stories are something that the New York Times publishes. I think it's weekly but they published a few of them. And they are Modern Love, quote unquote, which is a column about loves and you know, the modern age in miniature featuring reader submitted stories of no more than 100 words. And this one is called he tried so hard to remember me. says when my when my 61 year old father learned he had Alzheimer's. We went to CVS together and bought the largest stack of note cards they sold. I asked, What's the town you grew up at? We wrote Union Springs, Alabama. asked, Who was your first kiss Amanda. Four years later preparing to move my father into memory care. I packed up his desk. Taking the note cards felt silly. So I wrapped the long forgotten stack in a rubber band and opened his drawer to toss them away. Inside I found more no cards. They all said the same thing. My name yes, yes. That is by Drew Hassan. I believe that might not be how he pronounces his name. I've read that when I first bought the book of a collection of these love stories, and I burst into tears. And I read it when I'm having a bad day to make my day worse, actually. But I read it with a very specific thing. That to me II, everything that is so beautiful about humanity is captured in this little paragraphs where we try, I think just repeatedly, so hard for the people that we love. And that is what makes the hard moments so much harder. So like, when you lose someone, we lose, we feel so much grief because we love them. When we get someone new into the family, there is so much joy because we you know, hopefully in the best case scenarios, you know, we share love. And it gives me hope for the future. Because, like everything so far in our lives and in the human experience, I think that no matter what obstacles we face, we will try because of those that we love. And that is why I come back to this specific article. Because it reminds me to try and that human beings try for those that we love. Wow, that's sweet. I was not expecting that. I figured this wasn't what I figured it wouldn't be what you were expecting. I like looked at other articles, but like, God, everything's so depressing. So I mean, this is a little sad. This is depressing. I crack. Yeah, this was a little sad. But I think to me, that's like the human. It's my human experience. Right? We've talked about this, I think life is beautiful, because it is both sad and good. There are there are beautiful things that come out not because of the sadness, but in spite of them. Right. So and then there's a picture in the article of this huge stack of note costs, so codes. Yeah. I don't know. What did you think of the article? I don't know. I think it's sad. I think it makes me think a lot about those that are aging in our lives. Yeah, I read this for the first time when Dida our grandfather was starting to, you know, to like he started to like be a little bit more forgetful. Like you noticed that because he was one of the sharpest people ever. And then he started to slip a few times and I read this for the first time. Oh my gosh. Yeah, I think neurodegenerative diseases he did not have a neurodegenerative disease. He had old age but I think neurodegenerative diseases are horrible yep i A yes use do you see hope? Was that was I like I don't know. I don't really I don't see anything but hope. It's sad. It's a tragic ending but like to me Yeah. I see hope that the best you can do is care for those you love. Right? Much like you said, that's where that that's where that gets me. I don't see a lot of hope for humanity in that room. To be completely honest. No, because I mean, think about how much bad there is in the world today. I know you know about how much bathers are we flipping right now with no I know. I know. I know. You think about how much bad there is in the world today. I don't know it. How much time do you think those people doing those horrible things are spending. Thinking about things like this? Not but I can't and this is the quote you I can't think about what those people are thinking about when they do but this reminds me of loves resiliency within human beings as a whole. I've said before, I hate people I love humanity. And something like this makes me not only love humanity, weep for humanity, but also women be have incredible all and be inspired by what we can do based on loves. I told mom the other day, I told you this. I think anytime someone says To like, you're curious about something where you ask a question, and I've talked about this with you too. Or you write about something, I think that takes that, that just that little act takes an incredible amount of love. Because to spend enough time with something that you're going to write about, whether you're gonna think about someone else that I think is love, and I think that's what drives so much of you act, and power and greed, and okay, or, and lust, but like, this is this is really what like, you know, why don't we get out of bed in the morning? This because this, ya know, what makes me interested in this? Is I would want it to be more than 100 words. No,

Jack Weidner: 25:50

that's, that's what makes it perfect.

Unknown: 25:53

It doesn't mean I want to know the rest of the experience. That's it. No, that is there. No, it's not it.

Jack Weidner: 25:59

That's it. That's, that's a no, because because the ending is up to us. But you don't. You want enclosure, you have the closure. Because the point was contained in there. There was a beginning. There was a middle, there was an end. We know the end we know it's someone's diagnosed with terminal cancer. Oh, you know, like, you're watching the Titanic. What's the end? It's like, well,

Unknown: 26:31

we know but I want to know the middle. This is that's there's no middle. I know. I know. The notes are the middle I don't know. That

Jack Weidner: 26:40

that's it's it's it is humanity. At its stripped down bare spots.

Harry Weidner: 26:48

It's like the the alleged Hemingway for sale baby shoes never worn

Jack Weidner: 26:54

it. Yes, this is this is called something this is this would not be fiction. But there's something called flash fiction. And this is flash nonfiction. It's a flash story. But it's raw. You don't have time. It is Rob fluffiness. You know, like that. We know the ends. He told us the long forgotten no cards, but the right in front of him is the proof that you know, we try anyways. It's like why do we buy flowers? They die. We know the end. But we appreciate them while they're here. Yeah, that gives me hope.

Harry Weidner: 27:38

I like that that gives you hope.

Jack Weidner: 27:43

I like to get evidence. Well,

Harry Weidner: 27:47

you know, I think it's just interesting. What you and I have found open differently. I knew I knew that this would end up we would have very different articles are kind of figured. You know, I didn't expect you to go all the way back at 2019.

Jack Weidner: 28:05

Do you know what's beautiful about that, though? That's our disciplines. Yeah. Like your discipline is what was the most recent kind of thing. And my discipline is very much what resonates? What what allows a piece of art the power to resonate long after it has been created? And what puts it in conversation with what came before it. And why will it be in conversation with things that happened after? Yeah.

Unknown: 28:36

Thank you for that.

Jack Weidner: 28:37

Thank you for yours.

Harry Weidner: 28:39

I appreciate.

Unknown: 28:41

I appreciate man, I always learn something from you and learn about I learned

Jack Weidner: 28:45

a lot for you. i i HIV is something that is fascinating that I just don't know enough about

Harry Weidner: 28:52

it is and you know, to go back to it. The President's Emergency Plan PEPFAR P P. F. AR, for AIDS Relief President's Emergency Plan for AIDS Relief that's in jeopardy right now.

Jack Weidner: 29:07

Who started that?

Harry Weidner: 29:09

Who? Got bush? No, I don't know. Let's look it up. It was President Bush in 2000. Dairy President Bush over PEPFAR. So yeah, that is a huge fund for AIDS Relief around the world. And it's currently under Jeopardy, because a lot of places that a lot of places that offer HIV AIDS testing and resources, also offer abortion. And so the funding for PEPFAR is in this strange, weird space where it might get defunded now if we defund PEPFAR we are facing terrible global challenges

Jack Weidner: 29:51

read and all about this when roe is overturned. Yeah, it's not good.

Harry Weidner: 29:56

So that's, that doesn't give me any hope at all. Well, Oh, that gives me no hope in the HIV AIDS effort around the world and especially in the global south where they require money and resources to fight. HIV AIDS bad, bad.

Jack Weidner: 30:15

What can I can I be you for a second? Yeah, go genomic gives me hope about what you just said. But that President George Bush was the one who started that. Yeah. One of the when you know, someone and you don't have like, you don't want to like, quote, the obvious, and they look at you, and they're like, Am I smart? And you're like, You're so pretty. Like, George Bush is like the president. We're like, Oh, he's so nice. Not a lot of great things you could say about him. But he did start that. Yeah. Against what you would think the Republican Party would be okay with. What the Republican Party was, okay, well,

Harry Weidner: 30:54

but so think about Axolotl. Think about how there's so much less polarization than how, you know, there was so much more bipartisan support for but things like also,

Jack Weidner: 31:05

that was coming out of polarization. Think of how polarizing the 80s were. I mean, I mentioned Ronald Reagan before, but like, look at how that went. You know what I mean? Yeah. And Bush came out of that same party, and that same Republican mindset.

Harry Weidner: 31:20

But all right, 4pm. I've had a long day. Yeah.

Jack Weidner: 31:26

Let's end it. All right. Thank you so much for sticking around. We will do our best to put the articles in this description. I don't know legally if we're allowed to. I guess if we cite it, we can put it we could put my article in the description.

Harry Weidner: 31:43

I don't know there. You have come after us. Well, then,

Jack Weidner: 31:46

I mean, it sounds like we're putting like we're doing anything with Disney. Disney would come after us. Anyways, thank you so much for sticking around, and seeing how this mess unravels. If you have any thoughts, questions, please email us at our 20 minds@gmail.com Thank you to the few people who have emailed us here and I read your emails and they make us very happy. We will one day do a response to a lot of the once we get once we get back enough. We'll do a response. Yeah,

Harry Weidner: 32:19

we just got an absolutely beautiful email. Yeah, from a listener and that was awesome. That made the whole day made my week on Zapier right about it. Thank you so much for sending that. Yeah.

Jack Weidner: 32:34

Should we name person? Okay. You're a mother of one of our friends if you're listening, so thank you. Yeah. All right. Oh, Christ. Yeah, thank you. So why don't we add this anymore? I don't know. All right, or adds it to a setup